Thread Name: DJ/Book Title Disparities From: kamins at modernlib.com (Scot Kamins) Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 15:26:32 -0800 Folks, Bill Hornick points to cases where looking at a different place for a book's title can lead to confusion and sometimes to wrong book orders. He suggests that there should be a ModernLib page listing these disparities. Modern Library books have as many as seven places where the title can appear: ? DJ spine ? DJ front cover ? DJ front flap ? Book spine ? Book cover ? Half-title page ? Title page Here are two simple cases: -- The 5th DJ of 100.3 ( http://www.modernlib.com/authors/sAuthors/swiftJackets.html#100.2 ) shows Gulliver's Travels / A Tale of a Tub / The Battle of the Books on the DJ front panel. The same title appears on the book's title page. But the book's spine and front cover (#8 binding at least) both just list Gulliver's Travels. -- The 4th DJ of 181.1 ( http://www.modernlib.com/authors/pAuthors/platoJackets.html#181.1 ) says The Philosophy of Plato on the spine and front panel but the book's spine and cover say The Works of Plato, as does the title page. Much greater offenders include the Aiken poetry books ( http://www.modernlib.com/authors/misc/poetry/poetryAnthologiesJackets.html#101.2 ) and I suspect the various collections of Ibsen plays ( http://www.modernlib.com/authors/iAuthors/ibsenJackets.html#006.1 ), although I can't confirm this because I don't have any of them. (Long story.) I think this is worth doing. The nice thing about this project is that it's so easy for people to check -- you just look at the seven possible places for any mismatches! There are no dates to look up, no numbers to compare. You just look, and the disparities manifest themselves. Actually, perhaps you can skip the half-title page and DJ front flap. They may present differences, but since I suspect nobody looks there for book/DJ matching and ordering purposes, differences don't matter and therefor are of little use. I'll suggest a format for reporting after I see a few emails from people. I'd prefer to see a public discussion, but you're shy you can just email me (kamins at ModernLib.com) your thoughts on this -- Scot Kamins ------------------------------------- From: willthemad at aol.com (Bill Hornick) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 14:04:19 -0500 (EST) Scot, One question before I dive into the task tomorrow: Should I note a disparity when the DJ spine and/or cover or book spine omits the subtitle listed on the title page (e.g., G64.1, Moby Dick vs. Moby Dick or The Whale)? Bill ------------------------------------- From: kamins at modernlib.com (Scot Kamins) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 14:52:51 -0800 > One question before I dive into the task tomorrow: Should I note a disparity when the DJ spine and/or cover or book spine omits the subtitle listed on the title page (e.g., G64.1, Moby Dick vs. Moby Dick or The Whale)? "Moby Dick or The Whale" as far as I can tell isn't a subtitle, but in fact the original actual title of the book. So if it appears as "Moby Dick" in one place and "Moby Dick or The Whale" in another place, that qualifies as a disparity -- at least to my way of thinking. What do others think? Scot Kamins ------------------------------------- From: neavill at wayne.edu (Gordon Barrick Neavill) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 17:59:33 -0500 (EST) It's customary for publishers to print the main part of the title only on the spine. Subtitles and alternative titles?such as "The Whale" a re typically omitted. I'd ?note the spine title only if it's different from the title given on the title page. Barry ------------------------------------- From: charles.graham at dominican.edu (Graham, Charles) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 15:45:03 -0800 I am a small time collector compared to you guys, but I would tend to agree with Scott, seeing *Moby Dick* and *Moby Dick or The Whale *as a disparity. An amateur like myself might think they are two seperate editions and buy a duplicate. I have a list now, but that kind of thing might slip through the cracks. Chuck Graham ------------------------------------- From: brianlemasters at gmail.com (Brian LeMasters) Date: Wed, 09 Jan 2013 17:46:47 -0600 Scot, Would the purpose of the page be to enable the seller to clarify the book for sale? If so, the DJ Spine, DJ Front cover and Title page are the views I mostly see in pictures or are referenced in catalogs. When I sell books, I use the most complete title available. As a collector, all points would be of interest to me. When I document a book in my collection, I make sure all of the identifiers listed by Toledano are in the proper place in order to assign the Toledano number and then sort my shelves by Toledano number. A webpage expanding on Toledano's notes would be nice, but may be a bit advanced for some. Brian ------------------------------------- From: kamins at modernlib.com (Scot Kamins) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 16:01:37 -0800 Brian, The purpose is more to the point that Charles Graham raised -- so that the collector can explain what he wants to the dealer, or so that he can go to the bookseller with hir list in hand to search the shelves intelligently. I don't know what you mean by this: "A webpage expanding on Toledano's notes would be nice." Is this a restatement of this project's intent, or are you suggesting something different / additional? Scot Kamins ------------------------------------- From: rsanger at sangerswysen.com (Robert Sanger) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 17:57:54 -0800 Now, I know you all know this but there is a rare variant of Moby Dick where the name of the illustrator, Rockwell Kent, was included on the cover and Herman Melville's name was omitted. That was soon remedied, hence, the rarity. I think the explanation was that the publisher was so excited to have Kent as an illustrator that he forgot to include the author's name -- was this a story told by Bennett Cerf? Anyway, best to all, Bob Sanger ------------------------------------- From: brianlemasters at gmail.com (Brian LeMasters) Date: Wed, 09 Jan 2013 20:14:26 -0600 It was a restatement of the project. When everyone starts to examine and detail all 7 places in which the title may be found for every volume, the amount we know - physical descriptors - will expand (if there are disparities). Brian ------------------------------------- From: kamins at modernlib.com (Scot Kamins) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 19:01:48 -0800 I didn't know about this, and there isn't an example of it on ModernLib. Anybody??? Scot Kamins ------------------------------------- From: rsanger at sangerswysen.com (Robert Sanger) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 19:10:55 -0800 Scott, See, even criminal defense lawyers are good for something! <smile > I remember reading the story and then looking for such a copy -- never found one and gave up. Good hunting! Kind regards, Bob ------------------------------------- From: rsanger at sangerswysen.com (Robert Sanger) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 20:44:39 -0800 Scott, Okay, at home now -- the reference is to a 1930 edition of Moby Dick. It was a Random House edition but now I am not sure that it was a Modern Library edition. However, I found the reference. Bennett Cerf, in his autobiography, At Random (pg.72), said that, "We were so excited about it [having an edition illustrated by Rockwell Kent], we forgot to put Herman Melville's name on the cover, so our edition of Moby Dick, to the vast amusement of others (the New Yorker spotted it), said only, "Moby Dick, illustrated by Rockwell Kent." Hope this helps get to the bottom of it. Best to all, Bob ------------------------------------- From: zebradlj at yahoo.com (Darrell Johnson) Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 12:47:30 -0800 (PST) Scott, Another set that is notoriously difficult?is?the set of titles in Ibsen plays!!! Darrell -------------------------------------